Prediction Blog: Bowser vs Eggman (Part 2: Verdicts)

For the analysis part of the blog, click here.

Loka

ITS OUT

HOLY SHIT

There are a few things in life that I feel as proud of as this blog. I got together with some of my best friends, and watching all of us get to work on this thing, it getting longer and longer, an crazier and crazier with every month passing was a fucking unreal feeling. We laughed. We cried. And we panicked when this was revealed as one of the very soon to be upcoming episodes. Good times all around. And now it's out, so let's finally talk about it!

Bower vs Eggman. Where do I even start? Well, let's try to at least be a little focused here. At the peak of their power, they're basically dead even, given how they can both be scaled to theoretically infinitely multiversal cosmologies. Alongside this, the Chaos Emeralds, Phantom Ruby, Wonder Flower, and Dream Stone ensure that they can practically do whatever they want. They just need to really want it, and shit will happen.

However, while those things are what makes this fight so dead-even, it in turn also sort of makes them a non-factor in the debate itself. 

So, what are actual factors in this battle in my opinion? Let's go through them!

1. Battle tactics

If Bowser and Eggman are placed at equal or even relative in stats, I think it's important to consider that they would do with said stats. Their main tactics differ quite a bit, after all.

Eggman more commonly tales a back seat and sits back in his cockpit to fight from a distance, whereas Bowser prefers running in claws slicing. Immediately, this gives Eggman a pretty sizeable advantage. Although most of his minions are fodder to Bowser, he will inevitably end up taking damage over time which is likely to leave him weaker when he eventually gets to Eggman. Although it's only by a little, every small advantage matters in this fight

It's also worth stating that Eggman is smarter. This may just seem like an obvious advantage at first, but there's more to it. He's more likely to plant traps, use decoys, and create additional troops with the Phantom Ruby. Bowser can do all these, and not to say that he's stupid, but they are NOT his first instincts, whereas Eggman deploys them quite frequently.

This isn't just an advantage for Eggman, I think it is the best overall advantage he has in this debate. Is it enough for a win? Perchance, but we have some other things to consider.

2. Weapon usage

Bowser and Eggman's peak power comes from two specific items: the Dream Stone and the Phantom Ruby. In theory, these can be used for... anything, both of them capable of manifesting the users wishes. But what matters more in my eyes is what we see them actually utilise them for.

With the stone itself, Bowser has only ever wished for two things: a castle, and to "disappear Mario and Luigi". The latter is more important, because although he was cut short of doing it, it does showcase that he is more than willing to use it for a direct insta-kill move.

When using its power as Dreamy Bowser, he showcases some more versatility. Healing, size shifting, and summoning weapons is impressive enough, but he was also capable of cresting armies of minions out of nothing. I'll go more into detail on this in an upcoming segment, but that shit is major.

Let's shift to Eggman. He has used the Phantom Ruby to power up his minions, access alternate dimensions, and create copies of his minions. While that is a direct counter to Bowser, he hasn't actually used it for direct offensive purposes.

Even as Super Eggman, he only ever used it as a power source and for memory manipulation. Bowser and his minions have showcased resistances to certain types of mind control, which this could potentially fall under. And while it's likely that he could do it, Eggman never did showcase an actual insta-kill move with it, meaning Bowser could likely pull it off before him.

This extends to their other reality warping tools, which Bowser ultimately has a lot more of. His literally hundreds of power stars, the Pure Hearts, the Royal Sticker, the Wonder Flower, hell even just his innate reality warping abilities alone triumph over anything the Chaos Emeralds or Jeweled Scepter could pull of.

That's a point for Bowser.

3. Armies

Finally, the bulk of the debate. What I think it ultimately comes down to, both sides armed forces. 

In terms of sheer numbers, Bowser holds the advantage at first. Eggman usually doesn't reach beyond the planet, but Bowser spread his forces across the entire universe TWICE. This, really doesn't matter though. Like we established, both can create a likely infinite amount of copies of ANYONE in their armies on a whim, even extending to their powerful followers like Time Eater and King Boo. Trying to out number each other is NOT a possibility. (While Eggman does use this tactics more often, Bowser still has the numbers advantage, so it's likely that Eggman would be forced to do it first, giving Bowser the idea to do it as well)

In terms of basic troops, Bowser again holds the edge. Sure, Eggman's minions don't have a tendency to walk over cliffs, but even the most basic Goomba has showcased more sentience than any Motobug. This degree of thinking and ultimately sheer loyalty to Bowser also means that they'll support him through thick and thin, whereas Eggman mostly has emotionless machines.

But their stronger guys is a different story. Metal Sonic, Time Eater, and Chaos alone lay absolute waste to the majority of even Bowser’s more powerful troops, even powerful bosses like Petey and the Koopalings wouldn't stand a chance against them. However, there are two that do. Let's talk about Kamek and King Boo.

For good reason, they're the two most memed upon and hyped up members of Bowser’s forces, and thanks to the Dream Stone copies, he won't have to worry about King Boo leaving if the fight goes poorly. Together, they can transmute anything into anything, steal and warp away any items, seal their targets into paintings or alternate dimensions, and remain practically untouchable. Can Eggman reliably counter them?

No, not really.

There are specific arguments for it, like Infinite nuking King Boo with a sun, but 9 out of 10 times, I think the duo of Koopa and Boo are more than capable of handling Eggman's best. 

So, what does that leave us with?

Well, I think the advantages speak for themself. Eggman is not to be played with or underestimated, and the amount of advantages or win conditions he has should NOT be ignored, but in the end I simply think Bowser holds the better ones. Eggman can plan ahead all he wants, but he doesn't know Bowser, and even the infinite power of the Chaos Emeralds can't clue him in on his abilities. Meanwhile, Bowser regularly goes on the immediate offence against stronger targets like the Dark Star or Dimentio, and has no issues with bursting out his strongest attacks immediately. With that in mind as well as the power duo behind him, it won't take long for Eggman's forces to whittle down until only he remains. And a one on one fight with Bowser is NOT what Eggman wants.

But don't be sour. Just because I'm confident that Bowser will take the win, doesn't mean Eggman won't deliver an egg-shell-ent final standing.

This blog took us a year to make jesus christ

anyhow get ready the next two verdicts are YAPPER SUPREMES

Chris

Holy shit has this been a long time coming.

Hello, everyone! It’s Chris here again with another verdict, this time for a blog that I actually helped write for once! God knows how many months I spent browsing the Mario and Sonic Wikis, and VSBW, and checking whenever a new blog on this came out to check if I missed anything huge. It was a long and very arduous journey but we are finally here, and with this matchup being a part of Death Battle’s grand comeback too! How very nice.

First of all, I’ll go over everything I find to be the most important on both sides, from stats to abilities to the most important elements of their armies. 

So let’s start at the easiest (surprisingly) part of this whole ordeal:

Stats

This is obviously a very very complicated question, and something I’m going to take a while elaborating on. But before I do so, I want to give a brief TL;DR.

I believe that Eggman has the stat advantage in most scenarios, though Bowser has his ways around it.

With that said, let’s explain exactly why I feel like this.

Both Eggman and Bowser have impressive feats that make them comparable to Universal level destruction in some shape or form. Bowser has (theoretically) survived the destruction of the universe in Galaxy, can fight against Cursa who created an entire alternate dimension, and has been shown to be capable of destroying Dreams one by one. Eggman has various mechs that should be able to scale to the villains of the Storybook games who both possess universe warping and destroying capabilities, and would be comparable to base Sonic’s feat of surviving the entire universe getting destroyed at point-blank range. However, Eggman has a greater variety of tools that allow him to be even stronger. Without taking into account the tools both can use to potentially scale to their entire cosmologies (Star Rod, Dream Stone, Pure Hearts for Bowser and the Time Eater, Jeweled Scepter and Phantom Ruby for Eggman), Eggman has machines such as the Egg Salamander, which was capable of destroying multiple universes, and several, several mechs tough to enough to withstand attacks from Super Sonic, who is some degree of Multiversal no matter how you slice it. The gap in power isn't terribly huge, but it could make Bowser struggle in destroying everything the Eggman pulls out.

In terms of speed, Eggman holds the advantage…. Sort of. The greatest feats of calculable speed he would be comparable to are greater than what Bowser scales to… but only his mechs comparable to Super Sonic would be capable of scaling that high, and otherwise he's much slower. Bowser will struggle in speed against the toughest machines Eggman can handle, but if he gets them out of the equation, it becomes a clear advantage for the King of the Koopas. Of course, yadda yadda “consider characters at their peak” let's give the advantage to Eggman for now.

But that brings us to a very important question!

Hax (aka Wish Magic vs Cognition BULLSHIT)

Both of these two bosses have so many ridiculous abilities from their incredibly long careers that it’s very difficult to find something that guarantees a victory for either. Bowser has transmutation and bricking, but Eggman has the Chaos Emeralds and other ways of defending himself from it. Eggman has mind-control rays, but Bowser’s minions can power through it through MINION SPIRIT! Eggman has time manipulation through multiple machines, but Bowser can suddenly warp through space and time. Both can travel across dimensions, generate black holes, and do all sorts of crazy shit.

But it all comes down to a few specific pieces of equipment. The Star Rod, Dream Stone and Wonder Flower VS the Phantom Ruby and its Otherworlds.  Bowser’s ability to constantly bring his wishes and dreams into reality, including POSSIBLY erasing Eggman entirely, make him a gigantic problem for Eggman that he can’t easily deal with. In comparison, Eggman’s ability to completely overwrite Bowser’s memories is something the Koopa King cannot resist, and his memories have been shown to be vulnerable multiple times in the past. In addition to that, the Otherworlds allow him to have complete control over reality within the range of the Phantom Ruby, effectively giving him basically the same capabilities of Bowser’s wish granting arsenal as long as it is within that area of effect.

So who has the advantage in that regard? It’s tricky. Bowser is not an idiot by any means, but using his wish granting powers he usually goes for options such as “I WANT TO BE STRONGER!” or “I WANT TO BE UNBEATABLE!” and then proceeds to use said unbeatable powers to charge headfirst into regular combat. This could possibly be a lesser factor thanks to the Wonder Flower, with Bowser actually using many of its reality altering abilities to destroy Mario and friends, but even with that he still primarily resorted to brute force to eliminate the pesky plumbers, pretty princesses and Toads. Eggman would likely utilize his more strategic tactics such as overwriting all of Bowser’s memories before Bowser decides to wish that Eggman was gone forever or something like that. 

However! The Phantom Ruby has one key weakness. Its range. If its effects were to be disrupted by someone outside of said range, it would allow Bowser to have the perfect opportunity to defeat Eggman once and for all. And to properly go over that, we need to analyze my favorite part of this matchup:

THE ARMIES

Generally speaking, Bowser’s army is a lot better than Eggman’s. Most of them having complete free will and all being capable of acting completely independently allows them to constantly assist their leaders without the need for constant orders, making them far more active than the vast majority of Eggman’s badniks. Both armies are very huge, but Bowser’s galaxy-spanning armies from Galaxy gives him a slight edge in both numbers and range, as the amount of off-planet troops that Bowser has allow him to essentially carpet bomb Eggman with constant attacks coming from other planets.

But it’s not as if Eggman’s army doesn’t have plenty going on for it. Any electronics or generally mechanical that Bowser has is immediately going to be out of the picture thanks to the Zeti’s technopathic abilities and Sage’s supreme hacking, Infinite can ensure that their strongest and most useful soldiers will never be out of the picture through his Phantom Ruby replicas. Shadows that can potentially straight up BFR minions through Chaos Control, Perfect Chaos flooding entire areas of the battlefield… Eggman is absolutely no slouch here.

While all the members of the armies have their respective roles to fulfill, I think that there are three members on each respective side that are the absolute top priority in relevance for this matchup. The ever-so-memed monarch of the macabre himself, King Boo, as well as the Koopa Prince Bowser Jr. and his nanny/advisor Kamek are that for Bowser’s side. Meanwhile, The NOT WEAK mercenary Infinite of the Phantom Ruby as well as the masterpieces that are Sage and Metal Sonic serve as that for Eggman’s Empire.

All six of these characters play gigantic roles in how the debate unfolds, so I want to properly go over all of them and what advantages they bring to the table.

King Boo

Let’s get this guy off the way, he is a massive reason why people are likely to side with Bowser. And honestly? Can’t blame them. In most situations King Boo’s abilities could guarantee a victory. Sealing isn’t exactly the best resisted ability in Eggman’s arsenal, so King Boo’s paintings are a VERY problematic threat for the Doctor to be put up against.After all, what good is a specific mech or robot with a stat advantage when they get sealed away with little way for Eggman to get them back, especially when the sealing paintings can be as large as a gigantic hotel, meaning that King Boo could cover a massive chunk of the battlefield with a single painting in one go. Him being generally on par with Bowser also makes him a powerhouse that can fight against even most of Eggman’s strongest soldiers, with his abilities like cloning himself and phasing making him super dangerous no matter what. 

However, I might have an answer on how Eggman could deal with this pesky ghost problem…

Infinite

WHEN EVERYTHING YOU KNOW HAS COME AND GONE

Infinite is essentially the Phantom Ruby given a physical form that prevents it from being snatched nearly as easily and with a super edgy personality to boot. Infinite has single-handedly defeated entire armies all by himself simply through his ability to alter perception, meaning he has ways of making many of Bowser’s minions wind up self-destructing. As a counter to King Boo specifically, he has two primary ways of doing so.

First of all is abusing the weakness that all of the Boos have to extremely bright lights. Reminder, Infinite can casually create SUNS. Eggman has dealt with ghosts before, and those ghosts had a weakness to light. He’d simply have to tell Infinite about that, and all of the ghostly forces of Bowser’s army would be wiped out just like that.

In addition, the Phantom Ruby’s abilities to create whatever the user needs also proves useful. Eggman tech like capsules have been shown to effectively work as Sealing in the past, specifically sealing away a massive amount of ghosts that could not phase through it until Sonic opened it up. Nothing prevents Infinite from locking King Boo away in a capsule before dropping him in Null Space.

He may be a fraud in Forces, but Infinite is still extremely powerful. Taking him out is top priority for the Koopa Krew, as his abilities make him a danger of the highest degree.

Sage/Metal Sonic

Sage’s ability to control Eggman’s mechs without anything being able to interfere with her is one of the greatest assets that she brings to the table. Even if Eggman were to be separated from say, the Time Eater or any of his really powerful mechs, as long as Sage is around she should by all accounts be capable of commanding them all no matter what. Her ability to send people into Cyberspace is very useful as BFR, but Bowser’s most important assets have the ability to travel across dimensions, meaning it wouldn’t be a guarantee for her victory.

Metal Sonic is also very very important. His ability to learn the abilities of other fighters by copying their DNA is a very useful ability, and him being capable of utilizing Shadow’s powers such as Chaos Control make him a very powerful asset. Time Stops aren’t really something that Bowser can counter, and having Shadow’s abilities means that Metal Sonic should be capable of doing so without requiring an Emerald on hand. Him copying Silver’s ESP would allow him to undo any attempts of transmutation on Bowser’s army, at the very least while in his Overlord form, and generally speaking he is much more powerful than the vast majority of Bowser’s Minions, most of the generals included.

Kamek/Jr.

Kamek can steal Eggman’s items. This is the most important thing that he’s bringing to the debate and probably the most important aspect of the entire debate in general. Kamek doesn’t appear to have any limits to what he can steal, and has far less weaknesses than the Boos, making it possible for him to go as far as to steal the Phantom Ruby, its Prototypes, and possibly even the Chaos Emeralds themselves. Suffice to say that would present a HUGE PROBLEM for Eggman, as most of his win conditions are directly tied to having those items within his possession. Transmutation resistance? Gone. Memory hax? Gone. Being able to constantly increase his army’s numbers and swarm Bowser with his stronger mechs? Gone. 

Bowser Jr. is also here. He should scale pretty directly to Mario himself so he’s one of the strongest guys that Bowser has. The paintbrush being able to constantly create minions and portals to other dimensions also helps a lot. He’s just vibin’.

With all that out of the way… I think we have enough on the table to discuss both characters’ primary methods of achieving actual victory.

Bowser’s Wincons

Bowser’s path to victory is simple. Steal the items that allow Eggman access to his most dangerous abilities and mechs, and then overwhelm the doctor with a stat advantage and a barrage of hax that Ivo would have no means to defend himself against. This can be easily achieved through Bowser’s own sealing abilities, Kamek’s myriad of item stealing spells, as well as the boos and their constant item snatching. Without the Phantom Ruby and the Chaos Emeralds, Eggman loses any and all means of having his army resist hax like for example transmutation and mind control, both being some of the most frequent abilities one can find across Bowser’s full army. That combined with Bowser’s massive amount of reality warping equipment would quickly spell the Doctor’s doom.

Eggman’s Wincons

For Dr. Eggman to win, his primary path to victory would be incapacitating Bowser himself by rewriting his memories, and destroying the rest of the Koopa Kingdom before they have a chance of freeing Bowser. Bowser, once again, has not displayed resistance to having his memories altered or temporarily erased, and would be an easy victim to the Phantom Ruby’s power. However, the range of the Egg Fields make it so that Bowser’s army could very easily disrupt them if they ever had the chance, so Eggman would have to eliminate every single major threat to his victory within Bowser’s army very quickly. With his greater mechs, as well as the assistance of Metal Sonic, Infinite and Sage, this could be possible. Without Bowser, the Minions have very little reliable ways of matching Eggman’s much greater strength and speed, and Eggman has multiple ways of removing major threats from the battlefield immediately through BFR.

The Winner.

After all is said and done, who do I think wins? Both have a great chance of taking it all, and you could easily make an argument for both sound extremely convincing. But in the end, this is still a blog so I have to decide on my vote for the verdict….

And King Bowser is the one to get my vote.

Simply put, when their pathways to victory are placed together, one is very clearly the simpler road to walk on. Eggman’s lack of real counters to having his key items stolen from under his feet is a gigantic disadvantage that I simply cannot ignore. Bowser can match almost every major argument you can make for Eggman, but old Robotnik simply does not have what it takes to handle losing his one resistance to Bowser’s most dangerous, and oldest, trick. Once the Chaos Emeralds are accounted for, the Eggman Empire will face the same end as the Mushroom Kingdom all those years ago, as they are all slowly but surely transformed into nothing more but bricks. To give Eggman credit, his capsules would be a perfect way to defend himself against the Boos, but Kamek is a different story altogether, being much more powerful, much more dangerous, and much more intelligent. It would be essentially a quick draw on whether Eggman can realize how much of a threat Kamek is and BFR him into Cyberspace or the Null Space or Kamek can utilize his magic, and it just seems more likely for the latter to happen, especially with Kamek’s tactics in Paper Mario Sticker Star featuring him IMMEDIATELY removing Mario’s access to his own combat equipment before their battle can even start.

Eggman fought valiantly and this fight is much closer than most people make it out to be, but in the end the might of Bowser’s army, his far grander amount of overpowered items, and his reliable old nanny carry him to victory. 

Good night everyone, I will never debate this matchup or Mario vs Sonic EVER AGAIN (note: ever is basically just until the death battle for this comes out), and I’ll see you all in my next verdict. Adios!

Mannington

Look mom, I’m on the courtroom-mario

Do I really need to explain why I wanted on the blog for one of my favorite matchups? Beyond writing about tennis racket lore anyways. Mario is awesome, Sonic is awesome, my friends are awesome, they put Cheepskipper in here, and this blog was such a blast to write for from start to end. But the hardest part is always ending it, not because it’s been such a long process I have to say goodbye to but because these two have way too much oh my lord.

Yeah, this goes a bit further than cool guns and a nifty lasso. Even without bringing their entire armies into the debate, they have so many different weapons, powers, mechs, forms, and feats that compiling them all is a comically absurd venture. One upside at least is that so much of what they have directly counters or parallels what the other has, so at least formatting has a clear-ish pattern. So let’s go over every single thing these two have, bit by bit to see how they stack up together.

Starting on the very bottom of the pecking order, basic mooks and grunts of the army. Comparing the actual numbers is pretty hard given the rate we’ve seen Badniks produced and generators like the Baddie Box have shown no limit. It’s best to just say they both match in quantity. Quality is a lot more important and it seems to be pretty split early on. At basic grunts like Goombas and Egg Pawns, there’s not a huge difference, they’re all pretty much one trick ponies. A couple weak attacks or running straight into harm's way, not very substantial. Going up the line, things do get better with the likes of Hammer Bros. and Egg Stingers, but the upward trend is a lot steeper on Eggman’s side. There are a few Motobugs here and there, but the likes of Slicers and Buzz Bombers are far more aggressive than most of Bowser’s forces with the fire power to match. More ranged and defensive kits at their disposal means the average Bandik is going to last a fair bit longer than usual. But this doesn't mean most of the Koop Troop are out of the debate, far far from it. Most of Bowser’s weaker troops can be directly augmented by power-ups or other tools. Goombas need a bit more defense? Slap on a spiked helmet or Tanuki Tail! Koopas falling behind? Boom, wings! Shy Guys lacking fire power? Not when they pull out the Bill Blasters! Almost every single one of Bowser’s units have some way to put up a bigger fight, and the few that don’t already are pretty tough, and that gap in power Eggman’s troops have is a lot less wide. It starts to widen in the opposite direction even when most of the bots lack these same amplifications. The greatest versatility seen from a single Badnik are some occasionally piloting Egg Man’s mechs or using a slightly different weapon. Meanwhile basically every single one of Bowser’s troops can get a huge power boost from a single Mushroom. This is without even bringing up the one major difference between the two groups: Eggman’s machines are feelingless machines. Bowser’s minions are his goddamn minions. Aside from the bonus of free will for executing different strategies, every single one of Bowser’s Minions are loyal to an absurd fault. No matter who is in the way, they will stop at nothing for their king, even improving their power with a cheer or two from the right higher up. Even directly messing with their mind and memories won’t sway their devotion to their Burliness, something that will be very important later. Meanwhile, every one of Eggman’s basic bots are either pure circuitry or have a very unhappy animal inside that’s flying right away when freed. Overall, in the broadest strokes, Eggman’s troops can’t stack up to the loyalty and versatility of the rank and file of Bowser’s army.

But those are just the tiniest factors for this debate, time to pull out the real big guns, the generals. Both sides have a fair share of duds to get through though. Bowser has plenty of “Kings” or troops that are just super sized mooks that don’t have a ton of tools that can be quickly dealt with. Eggman’s primary tactical support and his own brilliance trivialize what support Scratch, Grounder, and the ‘Bot duo could provide, especially worthless in battle on top (not you Stone, you’re perfect). Rising up a few steps are heavy hitters that do just that and little else. Petey Piranha’s goop coating the battlefield and King Bob-Omb’s obvious fire power, Beta’s speed and strength the Heavies’ shocking fortitude and versatility, these are enough to take care of most soldiers. The Koopalings individually are incredibly powerful and some of the toughest of Bowser’s forces, all of them being enough of a force to fight Mario and crew on their own. Ordnance from Roy’s blaster and Ludwig’s tactical edge can upset plenty of Eggman’s forces. In turn, the Deadly Six are incredibly powerful warriors, able to decimate the Koopa Troop with tornados and sheer brutality, not even accounting for their techromancy neutralizing plenty of opportunities. These ones mentioned and others are all important pieces for keeping battles in their respective teams favor, but these remaining generals are absolutely essential pieces for toppling the others. Bowser’s top powerhouses; King Boo, Kamek, and Bowser Jr. And Eggman’s elites: Infinite, Metal Sonic, and Sage.

Bower Jr. boasts plenty of powerful weapons from his mechs to his Clown Car, all of which are capable of devastating swaths of mooks and even standing with other generals. His real power thought lies in the Magic Paintbrush. Creating more minions and mooks, covering the battleground with goop that can submerge larger mechs and bots, summon support items, and generally overwhelm most of Eggman’s forces. Something like Phantamanta can dominate ground troops, especially given its electric properties. All of this combined with Junior’s tech makes him out to be a huge thorn in Eggman’s side. That is until Sage steps into the picture. Sage alone already overtakes the Zeti in technical support, and should be able to control all of Bowser’s advanced machinery with absolutely no exceptions. This includes Mechakoopas, other purely mechanized troops, Clown Cars, potentially certain tanks and airships, and most of Juniors mechs. Shutting down these makes huge gaps in Junior’s potential while letting her swoop in with the Titan’s absurd power. Despite this, BJ still has his ace at all times. The Magic Paintbrush, despite being a creation of renowned tech wiz E. Gadd, has not been explicitly shown to be high tech. The “magic” is already a dead give away and the paint shows far more supernatural properties with item and life creation. This, alongside his other physical capabilities means he still can keep up without his toys. And to rub salt in the wound, Sage doesn't have too many targets to control on Bowser’s side. The worst damage she can do is disable the Clown Cars and mobility for major units. She still has plenty to bring to the table with everything mentioned above, but she won’t be as much a hacker as she would be a Titan commander. With the paint having no permanent counters, it looks like Junior has the best control of the battlefield out of either side’s forces.

Then there’s Infinite. As much of a fraud he was in Forces, Infinite is still undeniably one of the most powerful troops Eggman has. Any numbers advantage Junior could pull out with paint summons are instantly overwhelmed by Infinite’s own. Granted, these are shown to be weaker summons with how easily they’re dispatched compared to their original counterparts, Shadow and Chaos especially. But being able to make an entire army of them makes up for it. This is still only scratching the surface though, Infinite’s powers are quite literally… infinite! Warping the entire battlefield, creating other weapons and attacks including the damn sun, and being able to just suck up Bowser’s forces into another dimension and remove them from the fight altogether. While he hasn’t shown memory manipulation directly (more later) the rest of the Ruby’s powers are firmly within Infinite’s grasp. His upper showings dwarf so many of Bowser’s other forces that nothing looks like it could match him. Nothing except another gemstone wielding reality warper with a waaaaay better smile. Yeah, the King Boo glazing is just as strong here as everywhere else, I love my glorious ectoplasmic legend. Beyond being cool as ice, he’s got potentially the most utility and power of all of Bowser’s forces. Being able to conjure up physical illusions of mansions, King Boo doesn't have the same level of speed and complexity as Infinite, but it’s still nothing to laugh at. Weaker, non-physical ones at least can throw off Eggman’s troops and obscure Bowser’s other forces for a surprise attack. KB has his own dimensions and has been shown to travel through them, meaning he could potentially return members of the Koopa Troop from Null Space, or at the very least save himself. While it can take some time, King Boo could very easily create portraits large enough to engulf ships of the Egg Fleet in one fell swoop. Even single generals can be trapped if he has the chance, potentially taking Infinite and other generals out for good. This still does require closing in on Infinite and that’s far easier said than done. As long as he’s got the Ruby’s power, it’s almost impossible to contest Infinite for long, even for the greatest ghost in gaming history. But there’s one more trump card in the Koopa King’s army.

The last Hail Mary Bowser has, Kamek is already an important general through sheer magical firepower, shifting the environment through spells and growing the weaker minions to massive sizes to keep up. But he has a far more important role to play here, one that poses a massive threat to Eggman: party planner. Yeah, turns out “party tricks” includes mass larceny, the exact kind that poses a huge issue for Infinite specifically. The Phantom Ruby, that “item” which is the source of his power? Would be bad luck if it was stolen through magical means, wouldn’t it? This right here is what makes Kamek such a nightmare for Eggman. Kamek’s magic is able to reach over vast boards that can just as well match most of any battlefield, meaning reaching out for item theft should be a cinch. While most mechs and Badniks being one whole object means item stealing should not be possible, the Phantom Ruby very clearly fits that definition and is prime to be taken away in a swift, magical motion. Kamke can even keep this up for items Eggman has on hand, but that requires getting past his own trump card.

Metal Sonic is already a powerhouse, the only one to take over main villain status for an entire game without Sonic and crew even knowing. Even without Neo powers, Metal is one of if not the strongest solo act in Eggman’s forces. Fast as Sonic, powerful weaponry and defenses built in, and a nigh unstoppable force. His strength is no doubt enough to dwarf many of Bowser’s forces and outlast them too. Metal Overlord is even more disgustingly strong with further emphasis on widespread damage with missiles and lasers the size of buildings. At his peak, he could be enough to pressure Bowser himself, but that’s if he can get past all of his other troops without being worn down. The top three I’ve spent the past two pages blathering about are plenty enough to at least do that, if not outright destroy him in the worst case scenario. But this is without bringing up what makes Metal the special unit he is: lifeform data. Metal’s copy powers are incredibly potent with what he already has, but now he’s got an entire army to get data on. Imagine, if you will, a Metal Sonic with poisonous goop production, magical thievery, and the title of best Super Mario character. Horrifying. Don’t have to explain how a Metal Sonic with all of this wouldn’t even warrant a debate for an Eggman dub. What did warrant a debate were the child soldiers limits of what he could copy. After several hours of discussing the origin of Boo kind, their origins, and reproduction, we have come to the conclusion Metal Sonic can not copy the data of King Boo given his ghostly, very “unlifely” makeup. He can however copy Kamek and other Magikoppa’s magic, after a far less disturbing discussion. This does not include the amplification through their wands, ultimately making the copy far weaker. Junior dosen’t even give him all that much either, the paintbrush not being a lifeform at all. This is all without addressing the need for proper data to copy. Metal needs close enough observation for at least a decent amount of time to copy powers. While this is possible for some heavy hitters that will last for a long time, weaker mooks could get wiped out before Metal can copy them, not likely he would focus on specifically copying in the heat of battle. This leaves him with the aforementioned triple threat and other strong forces to copy, which would not give him as substantial a boost as discussed. Cutting off his most defining power, Metal’s upper limit isn’t able to be utilized as he struggles to keep up with just how much Bowser’s elite can throw his way.

That being said… it’s still goddamn Metal Sonic. Whether or not he can copy the ability to weaponize paintings doesn't not make him ungodly powerful. Basic attacks from Overlord can wipe out hundreds of Bowser’s forces in a single attack and effortlessly take care of weaker generals. With support from the likes of Infinite and Sage, he can very easily overwhelm Bowser’s top generals if they aren’t prepared. Even if he gets scrapped before he can actually face the Koopa King, he’s doing serious damage to at least some of the most important players, if not outright overwhelming them and taking some swings at Bowser. Even if his lackluster non-combat abilities can make him more open to versatile and tricky plays from King Boo and Kamek, he’s still without a doubt the fastest and deadliest thing alive… in spirit anyways.

To summarize a very lengthy comparison, both armies have absurd numbers, plenty of versatile troops, and heavy hitters that can be vital for facing down the king or emperor on the other side of the battlefield. Eggman has incredibly control of the opposition with Infinite and Sage paired with Metal’s insane power, while Bowser has a strong line up of tactical tricksters able to support his weaker forces, destabilize the enemy, and put up a fight all on their own through the triple trouble of his papa, his son, and his weird undead co-op. Both sides have strong advantages with these, but one advantage squarely in Bowser’s corner is loyalty. Barring Sage and Metal, depending on if the Heroes bugs are ironed out, very few of Eggman’s troops are sentient, and those that are would rather not be here right now, or beat down the doofus dictator themselves. This is the complete opposite for Bowser, only really having King Boo as a potential deserter while every single one of his other troops are with him to the very end. We’ll get back to the importance of this later, but for now, it’s two overwhelming armies in a near equal match, only a few strong advantages rising up past the rest. And it’s those advantages that will make all the difference when the big bad bosses finally face off.

It’s been four pages and we’re just getting to the actual Bowser vs Eggman oh god

Alright, speeding through basic powers and stats, Chris deserves the longest verdict here anyways (THIS WILL AGE WELL)  

In terms of stats, it's basically dead even. At their highest, both sit at absurdly high levels of multiversal through the same method of dreams, space, and party games being a great combination for a fun spinoff and a horrible combination for VS debaters. And for the sake of putting them at their highest plausible feats, that’s how I’ll be looking at them. Through their strongest gear, the strength and durability for both of them should hover around that same massively multiversal level. Speed is the closer and more important race, both sitting around the low quadrillions in calculable numbers, though Eggman potential edges out through Solaris’ light reaching so far so quickly, up to a roughly 20 times speed advantage to perhaps immeasurable. Regardless if this advantage is used though, both have plenty of ways to close the gap through timey wimey rubbish. Before diving into their more unique abilities, it’s important to give a quick look over their more directly combat focused powers. As mentioned before, weapons like the Koopa Clown Car are rendered moot through sage, but Bowser still has plenty of firepower, including the obvious fire powers. Fire breath that can burn through scrap and even phase through layers of armor are incredibly useful to have at all times, as are his showings with lighting and earth control. All of this without mentioning his absurd strength and tendency to just throw hands or ram into his enemies at full speed. Headstrongness that Eggman could take advantage of, but he hits hard enough to make up for that. His low tech equipment should also still be usable, meaning he can just keep chucking hammers with little risk. Eggman meanwhile is pretty straight forward with all his main battle mechs too. Egg Mobile weaponry is typically more on the gimmicky side with wrecking balls and weird spinning holograms, but heavy duty units like the Death Egg Robo, Egg Emperor, and Egg Dragoon are weapons of mass destruction. Each armed with several weapons to gun down or bomb opponents or just smash into them with spiked fists and giant lances. Pretty straight forward, but the deeper into their toolkit we go, the crazier it gets.

The two both have comparable companions with the Sparks and the Chao, able to boost their power and provide elemental boosts. The Sparks however have shown more uses for healing, hypnotizing, revival, and summoning, while the Chao just have a one time use for bringing Eggman back from death’s door. Still useful but the Sparks have a clear advantage in utility. A larger stash of Life Shrooms are more reliable than Chao and other revival items Eggman has, able to last out the support they can provide as long as Bowser has enough, as well as being used on defeat rather than needing someone else to revive him. Offensively though, both are in more of a stalemate with items. Status effects and transmutation are completely immunized by both of their items. Other offensive options from RPG items don’t really pack enough punch compared to what else they can do on their own. Time manipulation? Both have ways to stop or travel through it. Invincibility? Slim and Jade Ghost can provide support there. While they’ve both got a few places they edge out, neither of them have anything to truly and completely dominate the other. It’s only the best of their abilities and powers that give them that.

Bowser’s base reality warping is still a dubious power given how sparsely he’s used it, but using spatial manipulation or Power Star enhanced sealing can cut off forces not protected from it. The same can apply to reality and temporal warping Eggman can use with his Emeralds and Ruby. Even if they can’t directly target each other, they can mess up a lot of the other's army and manage the battlefield. The Star Rod has limited power from what we’ve seen, but is already a powerful weapon and has the potential for much more given its wish granting powers. The Jeweled Scepter too has incredible power on its own and in regards to controlling the planet and divide between the universes. More power boosts, battlefield control, and ally amps across these two. Looking to the stars, two of their biggest weapons can deal massive damage. The Death Egg’s strongest weaponry can destroy star clusters while the Galaxy Generator devours entire galaxies. Granted, they’d be in firing range, but it could do absurd damage to weaker members of their army and thin their resources. Bowser could potentially do more damage with these options I listed, but they come at the risk of either not working to their fullest potential and major friendly fire. Eggy’s might not hit as high a ceiling and the Scepter’s full power might not work on a non Mobius or Sol battlefield, the gems have plenty of powers and the Death Egg’s weaponry is much more controlled while staying devastating. Both can edge out some advantages here, though nothing massive. But finally, finally reaching them, their extra forms are major deciders on who wins and loses. 

Bowser’s got a lot more forms than Eggy, most of which are pretty potent. Major battlefield control and power with Black and Fury, and Castle even more so with how absurd his reality warping can go to benefit his troops and hamper Eggman. Changing matter, tampering with time, invincibility modding, etc. All of these are potent, but the former two don’t provide a huge enough gap that can’t be cleared and Castle has a pretty rough weak point if Eggman can close in. And Eggman is packing a form of his own to further bend reality. Nightmare Eggman has all those fun dream powers party game fans have come to hate, and reality warping is amplified for Eggman, to a more unknown extent, but still a potent enough one that he can do some damage. We can go back and forward on these debates over and over, but the least I could do is take it to the natural extreme: Dreamy Bowser vs Super Eggman. Likely his all time strongest, Dreamy Bowser is a horrifying threat. Bowser is already lilable to just use the Dream Stone for basic wishing, which could extend to “disappear” Eggman away instantly, dubious as the result could be with how wishes are manifested and if Eggman could resist erasure. But after inhaling its remains, that power is all his now. Generating super powered mooks, weaponry, and further power buffs shown in his fight are just the tip of the iceberg for what he can do. He could feasibly wish anything into reality with no upper limits. In any other debate, this would just be the end and we’d have a clear cut winner. But in direct response to that, Eggman has his Super form which does basically the exact same thing. Popping domain expansions that can be full of, again, mostly familiar monsters and weapons but have no theoretical limits on what can be pulled out. With their limitless power, it’s hard to cut through all the stats and abilities to say who could come out on top. There’s so much empowerment that as long as they can think of it, they can throw it at the other until the end of time.

So what if one of them couldn't think of things?

Without a doubt, Eggman’s most important power in the endgame is memory manipulation. Even if Bowser can shrug off direct brainwashing, at least to the extent of Hyper-Go-On and Metal Virus levels, his memories being directly tampered with is something he’s never shown full immunity to. While Bowser would keep his natural power and personality, including amps from the Dream Stone, he could very easily be given memories that shut those off, something to make him less combative and forgetful, the same thing that happened when he was just a “rookie” and forgot he could even breathe fire. While it’s unlikely Eggman will pop-off a full rewrite in the midst of battle, he’s absolutely pulling it out with Super Eggman and a single field can disorient Bowser. From there, he’s open to any and all recreations inside the Field. He’d still likely take a bit to wear down for good, but a witless King Koopa won’t be as liable to deal with the onslaught for nearly as long. This single memory altering tactic is absolutely devastating for Bowser.

This doesn't extend to his minions though.

Yeah, bet you thought we’d be done with these chumps, but they’ve got an army for a reason, and it’s gonna be the top ones at the end who can make all the difference. And they're making it for one big reason: loyalty. As said before, this is the big difference between Bowser’s troops and Eggman’s, and it’s finally becoming really important here. By the end of the M&L side-stories, nothing can directly mess with his minions' loyalty, and a Metal Virus or some memory tampering trick won’t change that. Even if the memories are altered, they’re still steadfast to Bowser until the very end. Weaker minions are once again struggling, but boosts from higher ups can help keep them in the game still. While not enough to match Eggman on their own, said higher ups could hold up against what Egg Fields can throw at them and try to take the fight directly to him. Kamek, BJ, and other troops could even move Bowser out of an Egg Field with magic or paint portals, potentially returning him to the fight. This is still an uphill battle given how powerful Super Eggman is and with Bowser at a huge disadvantage, but there’s one key flaw: Eggman forgot to cover the big glowing video game weak point. Taking care of the Ruby, through either destroying it or otherwise separating it from Eggman, undoes everything in the Egg Fields and totally depowers Eggman, meaning if he doesn't fall to his death, a reinvigorated dream turtle is laying into him hard and fast. It’s a glaring weak point that Eggman can’t really take care of, but it leads me to my final thoughts on what Bowser has over him.

When the Phantom Ruby was destroyed, Super Eggman was completely depowered. When the Dream Stone was destroyed, that was just the start of Dreamy Bowser. This key difference is what makes the difference between their powers. Nearly every tool Eggman has can be broken for good, a weakness Bowser does not have through natural power. Eggman can keep bringing tools back with the Hourglass, Time Eater, and Phantom Ruby, but if Bowser can deal with those, he’s cutting down his resources a ton. If Eggman wants to cut off most of Bowser’s esoteric and reality bending powers, he has to take down the Koopa himself. Only some of his amplified kit can be directly targeted, such as the Royal Sticker and Star Rod, the rest is just natural Koopa power or obtained through a much longer lasting amp like Wonder Flowers. Off the bat, Bowser can brick some weaker Badniks or suddenly warp through space and time if the battle isn’t going his way. Through Wonder Flower powers, he can directly amplify his troops to the point of invincibility and morph the battlefield to his whims, even controlling time. If Bowser can use this to keep heavy hitters like Kamek and King Boo in for longer with more power, they can be incredibly useful for taking care of Super Eggman. Heck, using item steals earlier on could take care of Eggman’s Immunity Idol or even the Emeralds and Ruby, softening him up early on (I swear I didn’t mean to perpetrate the stealing agenda, this is just where we are now as a culture). If Bowser can deal with these quickly enough, Eggman is down several important resources that he can’t counter. More and more options are off the table for him and Bowser just gets more and more free reign to steamroll opposition. Granted, Bowser isn’t the most tactical and likely wouldn’t be one to make a dense plan on which to resource take out when, but this is alleviated with Tippitron providing advice on the functions of them. Even if it takes a minute to get there, Bowser isn’t dumb enough to ignore things like the Hourglass and would be more than happy to just trash it if told. Slowly but surely, Eggman will lose important mechs, his time travel resources lost, no answer to Bowser’s own reality warping, the number of revives he has drops, and so on until he’s either facing down an army of suped up minions gunning for the Ruby or just stripped down to nothing if the Ruby was dealt with prior. No matter how they stack up at the start, Bowser is just built different, and it’s way easier for him to knock off Eggman’s key advantages until he can land the finishing blow.

With all this said, compiling everything into one final verdict, the debate is still incredibly close. Both have stats that can match each other blow for blow and have tons of items that directly counter one another or are rendered moot. But where Eggman’s strongest powers come from tangible machines and support, much of Bowser’s own power is all his own, making it far harder for it to be stripped away, and meaning he can strip away Eggman’s own bit by bit. And all of this is solidified even more by Bowser’s far more loyal and versatile army, able to make up for the gap between the less loyal but incredibly potent Infinite and Metal Sonic. All to support their king in the end when he’s incapacitated and pave the way to finish off Robotnik.

Eggman was an incredibly powerful foe, with the brains and manpower to back it up, but King Bowser was able to match every blow and leave this doctor scrambled.

Or he just calls Mario to win for him, I forgot about Ally Phone until literally right now oops

Dani

Dani wanted me to just link this

I-

ig just watch the video

Pit

Well this is a fucking doozy of a matchup. To say there’s more layers to this debate than the earth’s crust would be a hilarious understatement, just on account of how much is going on with both combatants. Even disregarding their armies, the amount of mechs, forms, random bullshit and what have you both have to throw out means there’s a million and one different ways this fight could play out.

Stats are virtually a non-factor (unless you disregard cosmology scaling) not just because they’re in a similar boat on that front but because there’s so much happening and so many players involved that no one character is gonna just solo the entire fight. This entirely comes down to which character can out-bullshit the other with their arsenal.

By themselves, about half of Eggman’s mechs are pretty much irrelevant to the match, because somehow I don’t think the Egg Walker is gonna pose much of a threat to a turtle that can bench press a castle. In terms of Eggman’s relevant mechs against Bowser’s variety of forms, they’re for the most part evenly matched, both in terms of stats and abilities, as there’s very few instant win moves one has that the other either doesn’t possess in some form or resist entirely. Transmutation, sealing, time manipulation, instant death, reality warping, just to name a few examples of this.

Obviously Bowser’s biggest advantage in this regard is that he doesn’t need to be inside a mech to make use of the vast majority of these. If Eggman is ever left out in the open, then he is, in the nicest but most accurate way I can put it, completely and utterly fucked. Eggman is far less about direct confrontations than Bowser, generally only breaking his mechs out when either cornered or his troops simply aren’t cutting it, whereas Bowser seeks his target out to throw hands with them as often as he lets his underlings deal with it. This means Eggman is naturally somewhat disadvantaged if the fight came purely down to a 1v1. Eggman is way smarter and still has options if it comes down to that, like using the Phantom Ruby to mess with Bowser’s memories as an example but that’s a fairly specific win con that Eggman isn’t guaranteed to think to pull out from the get-go.

Of course, it isn’t that simple when their various armies and troops are accounted for, and to say both have a lot of henchmen to skim through would be… really underselling it. Not all of them are completely loyal (especially on Eggman’s end, he’s probably lost count of the amount of times his minion of the week sent him flying), not all of them are gonna contribute anything, but the ones that do count for this fight, really count.

Whatever tech Bowser has is rendered pretty much worthless thanks to Sage being able to just hack and control it. Sage can’t contribute much herself otherwise but that’s still a pretty significant advantage for Eggman to have. Infinite basically acts like a second Phantom Ruby, Metal Sonic’s copying has its uses, the Titans could be annoying if they all ganged up on Bowser, Eggman has a good few notable army members that could pester Bowser.

Conversely, Bowser has fewer generals that are likely to make as much of a splash but the ones that do pull their weight in spades. Kamek’s trickery could snowball pretty severely, what with him being able to turn any one of Bowser’s army into giants or pull other kinds of tricks, and King Boo… yeah King Boo is kind of broken. Being able to teleport, turn invisible and intangible, manifest illusions or duplicates or just trap you in a painting or a pocket dimension, if Bowser needs someone gone then King Boo is his guy.

This is where I start to think Bowser has the edge. Eggman obviously excels primarily in the use of his army and is far more strategic and accustomed in this field, but don’t mistake that as Bowser being an incompetent leader. Bowser may not be bright, but as games like Bowser’s Inside Story have shown, my man knows how to use an army effectively and even pretty creatively to get the jump on his target. Bowser can do more than just brute force his way through problems.

Moreover, I believe Bowser’s best generals far surpass the best Eggman has to throw at him. Sage and Infinite are definitely problems, but Sage is mostly only relevant against Bowser’s mechanical underlings, and her Titans, while definitely obnoxious to deal with if they all gang up on him, aren’t a perfect solution. After all, Bowser having giants of his own and a loyal general that could turn even a basic Goomba into a building sized behemoth means he could overwhelm the Titans no problem. Infinite’s Phantom Ruby abilities as well pose a problem but a solid majority of their applications Bowser either resists or wouldn’t be phased by regardless, and Infinite has been overwhelmed even within the Phantom Ruby’s parameters a couple of times as well.

King Boo is about the most perfect answer Bowser could ask for against Eggman. Eggman can hardly afford to rely on his main strategy of sitting back and letting his robots do the work when King Boo can sidestep almost all of them and go straight for Eggman himself, forcing him back into the fight. Not much is really stopping King Boo from just phasing inside Eggman’s cockpit to give him a wedgie himself, since even with the gadgets he has on hand, Eggman is not winning a 1v1 against King Boo lol. The fact King Boo can make duplicates of himself or cast illusions just makes him even worse to deal with, as even if Eggman thinks he has King Boo down, whoops! Turns out it was a fake and the real one is right behind him waiting to make a Picasso painting out of him.

This is ultimately why I think Bowser has the edge in this fight. Sure, Eggman has a variety of strong options and for sure has solid win cons. There are for sure scenarios where he overwhelms Bowser from the word go with his humongous army or a lucky shot from the Phantom Ruby, but Bowser has just as many shots at overwhelming Eggman with his army thanks to his own bag of tricks. Bowser himself runs through nearly all of Eggman’s army like a track meet, while Eggman has generals on Bowser’s side that could pose a genuinely major problem for him, and against Bowser 1 on 1 he’s fairly outclassed and has more major drawbacks that could lead to his downfall. All this is assuming as well that Eggman even wins a quick draw with whatever move he makes to end the fight. Bowser possessing answers to the likes of the Metal Virus, Eggman messing with time, other uses of the Phantom Ruby, etc. means Eggman could just lose on the spot if he makes the wrong call. The same obviously applies to Bowser but even besides him generally going for the more straightforward approach of “I’m powerful, I punch the best”, everything I’ve mentioned has me believing Bowser could more easily bounce back if put on the backfoot if he were to make such a mistake.

It may come as a shell shock, but Bowser has everything he needs to fold Eggman like an omelet.

Tsar

You would not believe how long putting every single goddamn thing in this blog took.

Bowser VS Eggman, you know going in I didn’t think it would be so hard to choose a winner. But with everything involved? It got pretty nuts. Before I start rambling let’s get to who I think wins. I think the winner of this bout is going to be Bowser. Below is going to be why I think this.

Strength is an odd category, it’s a wipe for Bowser if Eggman doesn’t have his mechs. With them, it’s far more even. Even with this in mind, Bowser has plenty of more experience fighting people on his level than Eggman. It doesn’t help that Bowser has access to a bunch of abilities that Eggman would only have access to with his mechs. Time travel, reality manipulation, all of this Bowser just…has normally, with no fancy gizmos needed. If Bowser manages to get in close, its curtains.

Which brings me to my next point, their armies. Bowser’s more magic oriented army puts him at an advantage against Eggman here. Sage can’t exactly hack someone like

Kamek or King Boo. Which are pretty major reasons why I think he wins as well. Don’t get me wrong, Eggman is definitely no pushover. He can just outright erase or alter Bowser’s memories and is likely stronger if you don’t scale them to the highest they go (but like why would you not). But that’s all null and void when you realize while Bowser can’t stop Eggman from messing with his head. There’s absolutely nothing stopping his minions from interfering. It’s a close battle, no doubt. But I think Bowser has the magic, minions, and moxie to win this fight.

Now, who’s for some hard boiled eggs?

The winner is Bowser.

Aussie

Y’know, Wick vs Jacket was a fun matchup, but it was a bit of a ball-ache to come up with a verdict for, but at least that period of deciding is over. What’s the match-up this time?

Sees it’s Bowser vs Eggman

…fuck.

Anyway, very good match-up, and I’m happy that it’s being done by Death Battle when they come back later this year, but who do I think wins? Well sit back and grab a light snack, because we are going to be here for a bit.

Strength/Durability (Base)

This seems pretty cut and dry, but it couldn’t be further from that. In terms of raw strength without their armies, Bowser takes the edge on the physical advantage, as while Eggman is strong enough to punch away trucks and throw people like Starline around like fucking ragdoll, that is infinitesimal compared to Bowser pulling islands through the see and punching castles into orbit. However, while Eggman is shitstomped physically, a few of his weapons such as the Final Egg Blaster are capable of vaporizing stars, putting Bowser’s strength on watch.

But not everything can be so clear cut, as while one is clearly stronger than the other, neither can do anything to the other in base, as both of their high-ends for durability surpass their opponent’s high-end for strength in base. So if neither can do anything to each other in base, how about when they lock in?

Strength/Durability (Transformations)

Once these two pull out their absolute a-games, do the results become any clearer as to who has the better strength? God no, but it makes making a personal conclusion easier. At their absolute highest ends with Dreamy Bowser vs Super Eggman, both have fought on-par with their rivals trying their hardest, with said rivals reaching Multiversal scales, but Super Eggman and Super Sonic have more sound and more consistent high-ends, so I’ll give strength/durability to Eggman

Speed

Thankfully, this area is the single most clear-cut section in this entire document, as while Bowser is very fast through both him and his scaling chain, Eggman is able to keep up with infinite-time movers such as Sonic, especially once he becomes Super Eggman. Even if Bowser is able to find an opening, the illusions created by the Phantom Ruby can make that opening moot by having him attack the wrong guy. Another point to Eggman.

So, what’s left?

sees what’s next

Oh for the love of-

Hax, Armies, and why the VS Arms Race is a mistake

So, surprisingly, from a statistical and hax point of view, despite being a big focus on both characters, both the Koopa Troop and the Eggman Empire are nearly irrelevant in this debate, since the vast majority of what their armies offers can already be done by the two big bads themselves, though even then, most of what these two fucks can throw at each other is resisted or matched. Their cosmologies and armies are of similar sizes, both have power sources of Multiversal levels, both have ways of healing and cheating death, both have ways of messing with time, and both have ways of resisting any ailments inflicted on them by the other. However, both do have one trump card over the other

For Bowser, it’s King Boo, whose paintings can easily take Eggman out of the fight as needed, and without access to the power of dark light, Eggman wouldn’t be able to escape. For Eggman, it’s Time Eater, a creature capable of both manipulating and destroying space-time, and which was under Eggman’s control until he was beaten by the duo of Super Sonics. And of these two trump cards, Time Eater is the far superior one, with greater strength, greater abilities, and the potential to simply wipe King Boo from the timeline.

Conclusion

So there you have it, it’s my belief that Eggman pulls out on top in this debate. With greater speed, higher ends for strength and one of the most useful trump cards ever in the form of Time Eater, the dictatorial doctor was able to put the King of the Koopas in his place. Guess Bowser cracked under the pressure. And no, I will not apologise for that yolk.

Space

I know nothing about VS debating and this MU is crazy with everything that both characters have but I’m gonna go with my boy Bowser. I think he is way more durable and can probably take most things that Eggman can throw at him, and if Eggman loses his robot army I don’t think he’s winning this fight. Also King Boo sweep yeeeeeeeeeeah

Results

Team Bowser: 7 (Loka, Chris, Mannington, Pit, Tsar, Space, Sonic)

Team Eggman: 3 (Dani, Aussie, Mario)

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Hey, Loka here. Why don't you take a seat, I wanna talk to you for a bit. This is sort of a special blog, as its the first one I'm making where it's confirmed to become an episode. And I know that with this matchup, there are a lot of you out there who stand proudly by Eggman's side and genuinely think he wins the matchup, and to that I just wanna say, keep at that shit.

This matchup is incredibly complicated, and just because Bowser got twice the votes Eggman did here doesn't mean that he has no chance, it just happened to be that fewer of the Eggman supporters was a part of it.

I know that a lot of people who read these just immediately skip to the end to see the results, but just remember that in the end, prediction blogs like these moreso serve to get the general debate of the matchup across, rather than to be an end of all discussion answer to the matchups we analyse.

And hey, remember that if Eggman does win, you get the final laugh. Have a grand day, everyone. Hope the episode is as fire as we all want it to be.

(also, we said "egg" 506 times. Get to chugging.)